Electrify or Die
0:00 Welcome back to another episode of energy 101. We have Joel, Sydney and myself, Julie here. And our guest today is a new Perique. I say right. You did. You got it. I always think I guess
0:13 myself. And he is a founder of Pangaea Charging, which is, I'm gonna give like what I know, it's an EV charging charger that you're gonna put around everywhere. So people can charge their
0:25 electric vehicles. Would you like to explain that better? Yeah, I mean, I don't know if it'll do better, but basically a reseller provider of charging stations for electric vehicles. So anywhere
0:35 there's a parking space, we can electrify, but I focus mostly on commercial. So not single family residential, although people want that, I can help there too. Right, cool. So like apartment
0:44 buildings, groceries, still like really anywhere. Yeah, that's my focus as apartments for sure. Cool. Are they compatible with like Tesla or different types of Yeah, so I'm - Electri-Vee-cles -
0:58 Yeah, it's a great question. It's a very common one. It is universal. So the ones I'm working on are all the universal plugs. So people always compare it to your Apple Android situation. So I
1:09 don't actually know if there is a universal plug for, no, 'cause iPhone's still all over - Oh yeah, yeah - I don't know what I'm doing with Android. So I guess, I don't even know if there's
1:17 conversions, but basically I'm selling the universal ones, not the Tesla one. So Teslas would be able to charge on the plugs I'm selling though and putting out there - Cool. Tesla has their own
1:28 type though - Yeah, it's a proprietary - So they're like the Apple - Exactly, exactly. So you go to their superchargers today, no other car can plug in except the Tesla - Okay - Yeah, but there's
1:41 a lot of headlines coming out and that's changing. They're apparently gonna open it up and allow all kinds of cars to charge - Cool, that's cool. Let's back it up really quick. How did you get,
1:51 so what's your background? Like where did you start and how did you get into EVs
1:57 Why are you so passionate about electrification - Yeah - Let's just dive into that - That's my favorite part of my story because you cut me off when it gets too long. So I studied marketing, very
2:09 basic. I didn't want to sit and do spreadsheets, accounting, finance, when I was in bit, like I guess undergrad business school, but I always had this creative part. So I was like, all right,
2:18 advertising wasn't part of the McComb school at UT. So I was like, maybe marketing is similar. So I did that And a lot of the jobs recruiting out of college were that was available with sales. And
2:29 I actually didn't want to do that. I was like, no, old school mindset that you rewind maybe 15 years ago was like, use car sales, man, I got to get you to buy and I make money and all that kind
2:38 of stuff. So wasn't attracted to that. Actually, my first job out of college was with a geophysical like oil exploration company called ION geophysical. I actually don't know if they're alive
2:51 still or not, but so they had sold me on like, hey, you'll help us with green internal. communications and setting up recycling programs. Like, all right, cool. Like I'll make a difference in
3:01 that regard. Fast forward, that's 2008, get laid off in 2009. Market crash - Right, yeah - Only job I could get is at Google and it's sales. And so I say, well, I don't wanna do sales again,
3:15 but if I'm gonna learn it the right way, maybe this big company might be a path. So I do that for three - Was it here in Houston - It was in Austin - I love you, so the only job you could get is
3:23 Google - It's like, yeah - It's so easy to like - And that's what's truly, so I tell that out of honesty because it was, that was that how hard that market was in 2009. I was applying for probably
3:34 six months. Couldn't get any job. And then the literally only off-rhyche recall getting was for that role - It was Google - And it was a contract role. And so I took it, converted a full time.
3:46 And after three and a half years or something like that, in 2012, they were breaking down that team. I'm giving you the super elaborate versions. And they said, well, you could move to one of
3:58 our other office San Francisco, New York was gonna go to New York. My parents even threw me a surprise going away party. And before that party, I had already mentally checked in to like, oh, I'm
4:08 actually not gonna move. I'm not taking the job - Oh my God - I'm gonna opt for, yeah. It was like very embarrassing for, I think my parents and family friends who had given me gifts and all that.
4:16 And it's like, oh, this is, how do I break the news? But I opted for, what do you call it? Like a severance - Yeah - And knew that like I was leaving on good terms - Wait, so did you announce
4:26 that to your family? You're going away party - No - Show of my party and you're like, surprise, I'm super like, yeah, super clenching teeth. Like, this is, I mean, I don't even remember the
4:37 thought, but maybe I said, maybe I should go to New York - Right - Okay - 25 hands - I'm gonna have to move to New York. 'Cause 25 people showed up to surprise lunch. But yeah, so they had given
4:49 an option. If you just want severance and you want to be on your way, I was like, you know, this is like, Probably the best opportunity to make a clean break. get money and my friend was
4:56 traveling around at the time in South America. I said, that sounds phenomenal. Guy like me, if you can pull that off. So it was like a risky move being Indian. You get a job. You want to stick
5:05 to it. Um, anyways, broke that mold. Uh, didn't work for a little over a year or just about a year, 2012 to October, 2013, the only job at that point. Then I started getting back to applying
5:16 after traveling to South America. And I was like, all right, time to get back to it. What do I do? And I said, I should, after leaving one of the world's best companies, I should probably
5:23 explore, like what do you do after that? I was like, I, I've, I've kind of seen the best now. Right. And so I said, I should really try to lock into my like passion, which was sustainability,
5:34 which I knew since about high school and post college really started bolster that down. Found a company said, Hey, we do charging infrastructure for like the Tesla. This is
5:45 2013. So yeah. And Tesla is the only one at that point, making pretty generous headlines. If you're paying attention, it's like, okay, Tesla is selling model. Estella is right. And there's
5:53 charging infrastructure I was like pretty young and Naive Tull is like infrastructure, what does that mean? What are you doing? I just know Tesla and you're making headlines. All right, cool.
6:01 Apply. Interviews get the job. Basically do that for a company for two years. 2013 to 2015. Tough, tough, tough. Door knocking and getting rejected. Selling into oil and gas capital of the
6:14 world - You were here - So I was bassier then. Yeah, so I took that job remotely in Houston and was working from home first time, like fully remote And yeah, just go around to different properties,
6:26 offices, potentially because workplace was the bigger case where you could get a yes. It's like we got a bunch of it. Did you get any yeses because that was super early. Like you're just like
6:36 having to basically sell EVs at that point. Yeah, exactly, way different than today. Like today it's understood that it's coming. It's like, so, and it's cool because when you hear the stories
6:46 about people much older than me or older than me, you're like, we were in the telecom industry and the internet and when all these things were happening, I didn't know, I don't get it. But now
6:53 I'm like, wow, I was actually. in the early days seeing the evolution, it's fun. To look back and say, like, people had no idea, they're like, oh, they're nerdy cars, they'll never last.
7:01 And now we're just way, way different than that. So I left in 2015 from that company, went back to Chase of Paycheck, 'cause I'd taken a pay cut. And then I said, well, I need to readjust my
7:14 where I'm at. And so I did that three days into that job at, I guess I'll say it's on my LinkedIn, but IBM. I was like, ooh, this is not what I wanna be doing And so I knew at that point, it's
7:24 like, wow, I went from not making much, but loving it, to making more and not loving it. So like - What were you doing at IBM - It was selling like process automation software - So it was selling
7:33 sales - Yeah, yeah - Yeah - So software sales, and it was selling to like insurance companies, and it was just, it was not my cup of tea - Yeah, yeah - But yeah, so then I sucked that up for 14
7:43 months, and then got a calling to a company, which was the
7:48 leader charge point, leader in the industry at that time, and thrived at that That was like an amazing job. and got to travel over the East Coast. My territory was the eastern half of the US,
7:58 like 33 states - Wow - Didn't travel to the Dakotas and all that, but it was Texas up in East. And so it's funny to look at my counterpart who handled just the West, where EVs are big, but only
8:10 took 17 states for him to make his number. It took me like this entire other half to try to meet mine. So spoke volumes, but hey, you know, those three and a half years got laid off in 2020, but
8:22 interacting with those clients and folks I got to what allowed me to be on my own now. So - That's awesome. So it was a like charging, you were doing basically the same thing you're doing now -
8:33 Yeah, so - So you just went off on your own - Yeah, so I worked for a manufacturer. So I always give the example. It's kind of like I worked for Samsung and selling Samsung TVs. Now I work for
8:41 like Best Buyer myself. And so all the time - Oh, wow - And so, or potentially all the TVs. So I'm like distributor reseller, broker. I'm like using all these terms, always configured out, but
8:52 - Yeah - That's awesome - Yeah. Your business is basically, you're just sourcing the chargers and then selling them to the. Correct. Okay. And that's like in its simplest form, but I think right
9:03 now it still requires lots of education. So I'm basically consultant, sales. Yeah, you have to talk about like this charger versus this charger versus this. And it's like different price points.
9:13 Exactly. You're working with them too. Right. Okay. And different use cases, all that. Yeah. So it's usually I'm like, hey, what's your scope? Yeah, scope and budget and then I can figure
9:23 out where we go from there. Okay. Yeah. So how has it been in Houston now? Are you any traction here? So in the two years I've been in business, more of my sales have happened outside of Houston,
9:35 but that's not to say like the appetite isn't strong or anything. I think it's just these were old contacts and clients were like, hey, we're ready. Right. You reached out to us three years ago,
9:43 two years ago. I'm trying to think how much of a splash I made in those previous years with my employer in Houston because I was focused on markets that were hot. And so they're the ones calling
9:52 back. I would love to do more and see more in Houston, but it's just, I think there is clearly, right? Like we know it's an oil and gas heavy city. So there's always been some resistors I've
10:03 walked into a apartment. She's like, oh, you know, my husband works, she's a property manager. She's like, my husband works in oil and gas. And she's displaying, you know, like hesitations.
10:11 And it's like more personal than it is to the business - And now, like, I know you're snooty little charger - Right, and it's like, well, it's like, it has less to do with what your situation
10:21 with you and your husband have. It's like, this is about the business And your businesses, your customers need that - Why is it gonna say - I can't look at those influence - Yeah - It's more of,
10:29 are the people living in this apartment or community, are they driving EVs? 'Cause if they are, you need it. You should get a charger - Exactly, yeah. And my favorite analogy is you would never
10:41 live in a city without a gas station driving a gas car. So therefore you're not gonna live in that apartment without an electric car or electric car charging if you drive an electric car. So it's
10:50 kind of like you need it and it's totally bill it then. which anyone who's worked in infrastructure understand that. You can't like, Oh, we're waiting on the cars. Well, they're not coming. Go
10:60 into your neighbor and across the street - Yeah, I mean, it's only a matter of time. I feel like all of the new, I would think the new apartment buildings have them. I just moved into a new one
11:09 in February and I feel like most of the ones I loved that had them now - Oh, really - And I'm sure some of the older ones are adding them - So do you know, does yours have it - I don't think mine
11:17 does, but the complex my boyfriend lives does. They opened, I think maybe in 2020 - Okay - So they're relatively new, 15th street - Lots, they've got chargers - This is the height. Do you recall
11:30 when you were searching for apartments? Like, was that part of the amenity tour? Hey, here's the pool, here's the chargers or no - I don't think so. No, I mean, I feel like it's more so
11:41 because I don't think most of the time they give you a tour of the garage 'cause it's unless you're walking through it to get somewhere. It's not usually part of the actual tour. I feel like they
11:52 just mentioned, Oh. We have a garage, it's either, you know, you either need a gas pass or you don't need a gas pass, whatever it is, we have a call box, we don't have a call box. But I don't
12:01 think so - Yeah, see that's something I'd like to change 'cause I think it's important and we all say it's like, what's your first impression of kind of any place? It is actually parking, right?
12:09 When I show up here, it's like in park at the building. It's like, you can say a lot from that first second and it could happen - You know, I get like anxious if I don't know how the parking
12:19 situation is. Like I don't drive downtown unless I can like - You see a parking lot and like, I'm like, where am I gonna park? It's a thing, yeah - Yeah - Yeah - That's true - I can't believe I
12:31 forgot to mention this, but you were the reason, Fuse that we had an EV panel, which was really cool. And so next year, we, well, you set a goal and I'm saying we're helping you with this goal
12:44 is we're gonna light up East downtown with your chargers - There we go - That would be so cool. I don't know how we're gonna do it, but - connected with whoever, that's really exciting. I kind of
12:53 want to get into what - You just made, gave me an idea, hold that. I was just gonna say, I love that idea 'cause like how about like valet, EV drop-offs and like, I don't know - Oh my gosh, I
13:07 love that - I just wanna play better - Oh well yeah, well they'll take your car and check it in for you - Yeah, something, or just like car sharing, like shuttles, the electric, I don't know -
13:14 Yeah, yeah - What's - Parking does suck down there, so like - Yeah, yes it does - All the Ubers can be EVs - Yeah - Something like that - Yeah - I'm surprised that isn't a thing. 'Cause you know
13:24 how Alto is like the new like, fancier Uber 'cause it's all, I've never heard of that. So it's basically Uber, but it's, they own their cars, their drivers are full time, and it's like a
13:34 membership subscription, so you pay, I don't know, 50 bucks a month. And so it's, I think their draw is that it's always new cars, it's a little bit, it's safer - Right - You know 'cause at
13:43 Uber, they also have, they screen their drivers and then you hear, you know, some poor girl getting kidnapped or something - Yeah - But they're, it's safer, it's just a little, You know what
13:53 you're getting every time, you know? So you're not gonna order it and get some beat up car with a sketchy driver, but I'm surprised that no one has capitalized on that. 'Cause I feel like there
14:04 are so many people that care about electrification, that there's not an option on - I know in New York - Over anything to like, oh, like a request. Yeah, to request an EV or request something.
14:15 Right. Have you ever heard of Rebel? Yes. So they have that in New York. I went to college in New York and I think they're all electric vehicles. They are, they do like electric scooters.
14:25 Scooters, yeah. I wish I'd rent them. And then now they've gotten into big like fast charger that got a big hub in Brooklyn. Yeah, it's a big thing in New York. Right. You had to like get on a
14:34 wait list too. Wow. To be able to use it, yeah. Anyways, I thought that was cool. That was cool. Lifton Uber, I think, they all are now setting like goals of like, hey, we want our fleet to
14:43 be X amount of electric by electric. Yeah. 'Cause you think like as a dog mom, I can request an Uber that is pet friendly if I wanna like Uber with Sunny, my dog too, like a bar or whatever. So
14:55 you would think that you would be able to request - That's cute - That's like an easy, me and Sunny rolling up in a Tesla - Yeah, they should have that, Lisa - I know, it's such a big city - I
15:06 think there's an option for like, they say like green or eco-friendly. So maybe it could be high-grade - Oh, high-grade, yeah - Yeah, yeah - Yeah - And it does depend on market, so. Sorry, I
15:16 cut you off on a question - No, it's okay I was just gonna say, I would like to get into
15:24 kind of the, not really a debate, but you know, the reasoning behind wanting to go towards EVs. This is
15:34 like, you're talking to like your grandma, who's like, well, I've driven a car for however long and there's no problem - Right - How do you explain to people like the benefits of EVs and kind of
15:48 how that compares or, you know, how does that fit into - sustainability, what you're passionate about - Sure - Does that question make sense - Yeah, and I could go a lot of directions, but again,
15:58 you know, just cut me off when you fall asleep. It's that, so I had an aunt, let's say, somewhere in her 60s, who I'd say like this, what I do, and she's like, You all are not changing, like,
16:10 very unlikely. And I said, Why? And she's like, Oh, it's too complicated, like basically too old to learn and this and that, or like change over. Seems too scary. And I said, Well, a couple
16:19 of years ago, maybe under 10, you got a smartphone and you figured that out, right? And look how better your life is, aside from like, whether or not this is sustainable, I don't know, but my
16:29 point is it didn't take much. You sat there for maybe a week, and you got a hang of it and never looked back.
16:36 And so I kind of put that out there, but she said still, but still, right? So, harder maybe with like an audience that is, like you said, grandma, very used to how things have been done and
16:45 will continue to do so, but, and that one is probably, I was at a conference, three weeks ago and they said they had this age group. I think it was like 18 and 24, 25 to 35. All the way up,
16:57 there was four categories in the 60 and up was the only one where they fell slightly below. So across those age groups, almost 70 had expressed some interest. There was only like at the highest,
17:12 if I'm saying this right, 30 said absolutely like not interested. So it tells me that even older folks are open to it, but what is like maybe the value prop, right? Is that no tailpipe emissions,
17:24 no ongoing maintenance oil changes. I think it was cool. One of my, the first company I worked for that mentioned in 2013, he said, well, something along the lines of when was the last time you
17:34 changed the oil on your refrigerator and it like causes all the pause. Yeah, exactly. I was like, what are you talking about? And then it's like, well, that's an electric motor. And that last
17:46 typically, so long, 10 years or something, you do anything to it. a clever way to someone who's not technical and engineered, I just put that in terms of that I could understand, oh yeah,
17:56 that's an electric motor and just runs. And it doesn't require new parts and belts and oil changes. And so that's similar to a car.
18:05 And then maybe like kind of what you said, I just want to throw this out there because I feel like this is my chance. It's that people say, well, you know, you're still fueling that electricity
18:14 from some power plant, coal plant - I was gonna ask that - Oh, that's tough And so I think they call it the long tailpipe. So it's saying like, hey, you know, yes, there's no immediate tailpipe,
18:23 but somewhere out there, there's a plant producing emissions. And I guess that's fair, but I'll never pretend to be an engineer. So we'll just put that out there. So I think in just very logical
18:33 terms for me, it's that it's kind of grim and I give you this analogy. So if you take a garage, you put a gas car, an electric car, and you put a human or a child in one of those cars in
18:45 Closegarage, which one would you want them and feel safest with them in? I'm sure, exactly - That's terrifying - That's true - It's so terrifying - And know it is though - And it's so, yes, but
18:55 it's like, why wouldn't you? Because, well, you know exactly what's happening with that one. And I go very like, holistic, is like, guess what, the earth is a living being. It's got lungs.
19:04 And just because you don't see it doesn't mean you're not pumping fumes into its lungs. And so, that's why I'm just like, yes, it happens, but you can, you know, whatever the fuel source is and
19:14 we're obviously moving towards more renewables. So it's just gonna be an ecosystem where I think there's just fewer emissions from it - I wish I could remember,
19:23 when we were at Hitesville Garden for the energy tech startup launch party, we were talking about Tesla's and I said something to Lara and she, to that effect. And she, I wish I could remember a
19:33 word for her. I'll have to ask her and we'll do a little, I'll comment on when we released this episode of what she said. But she had a great argument for that 'cause I kind of said, to that point,
19:44 you know, well, it's still coming from somewhere. the power, the energy is still coming in the manufacturing and when you plug it in. And she said something along the lines of if a certain amount
19:55 of people drove EVs, like she had a stat for how much lower - Something air pollution - Yeah - Especially here in Houston, how it's so congested. It's like the air pollution of all of it combined -
20:08 Right - But I think it's, she also - But I was like, brought up right - Point of like, right now it's a luxury Like right now you can't really get, it's not affordable forever - Yeah - So it's
20:21 like, you have to work to that point - And I'll challenge that just a little because yes, true for me too. I've constantly put this off because it was like somewhat out of reach and now though on
20:32 Carvana or any of these things you can see a EV for used for about 20K. So it's kind of like if you can afford a camera then you can probably get an EV. And again, the other one is like commuter,
20:43 right? You're people will say, oh, I can't drive to California. 150 mile range car. Well, how often are you driving to California? Right? Like it's let's be realistic. You're going to Kroger,
20:53 HEB. Work, daycare, blah blah blah, you're probably doing your What is the gas price compared to the electricity costs? Is that like a comparison that you can? Yes, yes, absolutely financial
21:06 savings on refueling. So typically With kind of I say stable, but just knowing where gas usually is and where electricity is today About a third of the cost of gas. So to fill up a gallon, right?
21:20 Let's call it three bucks if that's fair And you get 25 miles on an efficient gasoline car that same 25 miles in electric cost you a third of that So probably a dollar if not even less. Yeah, okay.
21:34 Well, I would think to To that point of like how many people are driving that much and I think now I think unless you're in a a sales shop where you have a big territory where you're driving not
21:46 everyone is going into the office every single day now. So maybe it does for those people. Cause I think that would always be my thing before I started working here. I was in sales and I covered
21:56 Houston Austin, San Antonio, a little bit of Dallas. So in my mind. It would be harder for me, mostly harder, but more effort on my part to keep track of, Oh, I got a charge. It's, it's not
22:08 as readily available. If I'm driving, I almost rented the gas on 45 once I was down to like a one mile And I can't imagine if I was down to a certain percentage of charge and there wasn't one
22:19 available, but to get requires a more planning. But now it is, but now with people, you know, aren't doing that as much. You know, I think it makes sense. Yeah. And I mean, free plug for a
22:31 company, I believe it's called spark charge, but think about today, you do run out of gas. They give you like maybe a gallon or a couple gallons in that red canister to get you wherever you fill
22:41 up for full or if your battery dies, you get like someone Now with like little mobile batteries, they just jump in. Oh yeah - Yeah, so I just saw that recently 'cause I'm used to like plugging in
22:49 cars with another car on that - Yeah, great - But I saw that they brought a little battery and they just gave it a jolt and it charged. So now they're coming with like mobile huge batteries that
22:58 they bring to you and just call it jump it - Are there, you know how like, there are portable charges for your iPhone. Are there things like that for EVs to where you could keep it in the car and
23:09 maybe it only gives you a certain charge, but if you do run out, it'll get you enough - Yeah, so they, most cars will come with like a standard wall connector or like your basic wall outlet. So
23:21 you could show up to some gas station on the middle door and like, hey, yeah, plug in. Assuming yeah, the receptacle's open. But yeah, I mean worst case, that is your option - Gotcha. I have
23:32 a random hope, go ahead. Oh, no, you go. My question's random. If you were to do that, how long would it take to get like fully charged? on a guess, like on just a regular plug-in wall. Just
23:45 teed up this question perfectly, 'cause I wanted to answer this one. So there's the industry talks about in like levels, three levels of charging. So level one is considered plug into the wall.
23:58 So I'll just basically tell you it's like a dropper, a regular straw, and then a fire hose. So those are like the three levels that visually I like people think about. So that's painfully slow.
24:08 If you had to drink water through a dropper, but if you had eight hours like plugging in at home, it might be sufficient You're just in bed, you're not doing any work - Or if you were at a hotel or
24:17 something, and we're staying overnight anyway, it could just, yeah, plug it - Right. So it's about three to five miles of range per hour of charge on that outlet. So in sweet bait hours, you're
24:26 gonna wake up with 25 to 40 miles of range. Probably pretty doable for average commute. Assuming you're like, you don't want just the 40 miles, but if you're already just topping off as they say.
24:38 Level two, which is the apartments, the grocery stores, office buildings, That's about 25. 20 to 25 miles of range per hour of charge. So that's kind of very commercial application. And then
24:51 level three is gonna be your probably gas stations. Hey, we're just gonna pump a whole lot of juice over a short period. So anywhere from 100 to maybe 200 miles somewhere between 10 to 30 minutes -
25:04 Wow - So that's kind of - That is like exponentially faster than the other two. I'm glad you explained that too because when we were at your party the other day, we were talking to Jason and he was
25:17 talking about level three chargers. And I'm like, yeah, and I like what it was - And here we are - Yeah, exactly. I love breaking that down because - Yeah, that's a good way to explain it - Yeah.
25:28 So yeah, I'm glad to get that feedback - Well, and that it makes sense 'cause I feel like,
25:33 I don't know if I'm speaking for all EV owners, but I always see at the grocery store and Whole Foods and random people just plugged in. So it makes me think if I had one, but I just plug in
25:42 anywhere there was a charger just to get a. like, yeah, just to have a re-up and just keep it at a level that isn't terrifyingly low so that I'm not potentially stranded. Well, how do you have to
25:53 pay? Do you have to pay when you plug in it like, like Whole Foods or something? No idea. It's different everywhere today.
26:01 The model has mostly been today that the property itself is buying it. And then all these providers saying you set the rate, you have an option to collect revenue. So you give it away for free for
26:12 an apartment or you could charge that driver, resident, the fee that you think is fair and the market would accept. So a lot of people historically have been doing it free because they're like, Oh,
26:23 it's just the two cars over a month and they're charging like 17 bucks. Like, not a big deal. We don't want to reflect that. But as we get to like a hundred cars charging your property and your
26:31 bill goes to like 3000 or whatever that number is and like, just you want to recruit that. Yeah, that makes sense. Yeah. Yeah. You are. This might be a silly question, but how do you know
26:40 where the charges are? Are you just winging it? And is there an app? When you go to Trader Joe's - Charging Trader Joe's - Yeah, yeah - We should build that app - It doesn't
26:55 exist -
26:57 Oh, I was like, where do we reach - I'm on something here - We have to edit like a light bulb in there - Oh, sorry - There
27:03 is, there's a number of them.
27:06 But the most part - Well, you're selling your chargers. Like, do you go, like, how does that work with the apps that are already out there - So, I guess, what do you mean - So like, you sell
27:22 charging stations - Yeah - How do people know where to find them - If you install somewhere, yeah -
27:29 So, pretty much every manufacturer, and like, so there's two components that charge your hardware, and then like, ongoing service software. And so all these companies that are typically
27:39 providing software too, they're like, they have their own app - Right - So it's like, McDonald's Chick-fil-A all having their own apps. So you can locate on their specific app, but then there's
27:47 aggregators like a plug share. That's one of the most popular. And many of them are starting to aggregate all them because you're just not gonna get the attention if you just show yours. And then I
27:59 hear it's been, I don't know the details, but Google Maps, right? Like that's like the, probably gonna be the best one 'cause you're already on Maps - That are auto maps for some ways - Yeah,
28:10 exactly - Because they already have gas stations, which is now about fueling stations - Right, right. That's interesting. Okay, random question 'cause I actually don't know the answer to this.
28:18 What was the first mainstream electric vehicle - Man, see, this is where I wish I knew my history better, but the first mainstream, man, part of me wants to go back to like, what is it, the
28:31 1920s, 30s, 10s - But I mean, electric cools - It's like nowadays - Nowadays, yeah. So then in the 90s, early 90s, General Motors had something called the EV1,
28:44 Documentary for like I was introduced it to my first employer in this market But it was a who killed the electric car and it's fascinating because it was like it was prime. It was ready to go It
28:54 seemed to work, but it's wild. Yeah, I know I'm thinking like it's Tesla
28:59 In modern era absolutely like that is what popularized that because even I didn't know about the EV1 I mean I would have been five or six years old but I know about it Wait, what year did I early 90s?
29:08 I think wow Is a pre as a hybrid it's on the Eats a hybrid the which one the pre is They have both it's a battery hybrid, but then so there's actually three types of cars. There's Hybrid right which
29:23 is like the original Prius which
29:25 was just Getting juice back every time you break right so I feel like that was one of the first Hybrid cars. I think you heard people absolutely, you know, I'm gonna get a Prius save the
29:36 environment I'm gonna get a Prius. Yes. That was the first kind of big push right and then there's plug-in hybrids of the called PH EV like plug-in hybrid electric vehicles. So you can actually now
29:46 charge the battery directly and then there's battery electric all plug-in and all battery, no gas. But yeah,
29:54 I would say that EV1 or the Tesla, Model S - What was the documentary called? Was it called - Who killed the electric car - Wow - And they, yeah, it was just like, it was sad 'cause they, I
30:04 remember they showed like the graveyard where they just, they recalled or did something and just took all these cars and no one really knew. I think there's called it conspiracy or whatever The
30:12 reason was like why it got killed. Who knows who was a - Oil company - Oil company - I didn't wanna say about it. Someone didn't want to go - I didn't say that - Someone didn't want to evolve and
30:22 show, well they didn't die but - Oh yeah - They did show us to die - They did let the EV1 die. So, but yeah, now GM seems to be evolving - Yeah - But yeah, it is fascinating. I would watch it -
30:36 Yeah, I'm going to. I think it's really cool how much cooler the EVs are now - Yeah, 100 like from a Prius to a lightning.
30:44 Like that's cool, yeah, it's come a long way. Well, and I think in my mind, this is the first one that I've seen or just recognized. I've seen, I feel like, so the Tesla's like, they're not
30:55 huge, even their SUV is not big. And you think how many families need a third row of seats because they have 1, 000 children and they travel at they, shout out, shout out to the talent family.
31:09 Jules has
31:11 1, 000 brothers and sisters. Are you one of those sisters - Oh, okay - And so, but I just saw, I can't remember if it was, who it was, but someone has a large electric SUV now that has three
31:22 rows of seats - They actually have the big - Wait, really - They end, like, special brands, right - Yeah, I can't remember if, oh no, I was, no, they do, I feel like it was either BMW or
31:31 Mercedes, it was a luxury brand, but they have a big electric SUV now. 'Cause before - It's like a sprinter van, right?
31:41 I mean, there's tons out there - Yeah - So I think I just saw someone took delivery of the Rivian SUV. So they had been releasing the trucks. Now they had the SUV, three rows of seating. But
31:51 everyone's like promised something in the coming before 2025 maybe - Right - So it'll be, what are we going into 23? Yeah, I think by 2025 you see ample selection of - That's so crazy to think
32:03 about the year 2025 - Right - Like it sounds so futuristic - I know, it does - It's like two years away - Just written it looks, yeah, it sounds futuristic - Yeah, I don't like it - I don't like
32:12 it. It makes me feel old. Do we have any other questions?
32:18 I'm trying to think of any questions that are super, does anything else come up whenever you're talking to people about EVs or hesitations or anything you like to educate people on? Or even like
32:31 sustain, like you see me right now. I mean, Maggie educated. I promised her I wouldn't do this, but here I am - I know this is any better, but. I'm gonna start your phone - I mean, I think I
32:44 was reading something last night. This guy was like, mining, right? Hey, you're mining for lithium. These batteries, what happens after them? And like they're going out after 10 years like,
32:52 well, the Prius, again, these are all things I've read. I'm not the expert on like researching everything, but I read about certain things. And it said that where people are concerned about
33:02 battery life, like, hey, we're gonna have to pay 10, 000 in 10 years to replace battery 'cause it's not good technology. And they found like, at least with the Prius, those cars that might have
33:10 started in what like early 2000s had blown past 2010 or 2015 and they kept working. So it was like, you didn't need to replace it. So I think that's one is that battery life is longer than maybe
33:22 previously thought. And then two is that mining for the lithium, it was just like, it's ultimately, you know, the one I was reading last night by a post, I think his name is James Carter.
33:33 Heavily involved in the EV market, but he said liquidium it's, stuff this all, gas, oil, know you, when you're extracting.
33:41 it has chances to leak and move, whereas with rock or lithium, it's just less of that. It just kinda just sits or something. So there's that part,
33:54 yeah, I mean, I don't know. I don't know how much more context I add to that other than that. There's a lot of mining that's gonna happen, but perhaps less dangerous and less adverse effects -
34:05 Yeah, and that's a goal. Did I just go - Yeah, exactly Before we do the rapid fire questions, I want you to show off your best marketing piece you have. Please tell it, I don't think they know.
34:16 I told the media the other day. Please tell the story - So she's, I think referencing this. Do you know who Johnny Dang is - No - What - Okay, what - What - Embarrassing - Who's from, you don't
34:30 know who Johnny Dang is - You're either of y'all native to Houston - No - Where do you originally - Florida - Florida - I am - You are native to Houston - I can't believe you don't know who Johnny
34:37 Dang is The grills. Oh.
34:41 You gotta give me some context here before you come in - Johnny -
34:45 Johnny, yeah - You just appointed - Is this a serious story - I'm a lawyer - From your Midland person. She's dropping some serious Houston - Oh, didn't he do all the girls for the Astros - He did -
34:55 That's what, yeah. World Series Girls - I didn't got it - Paul Wall has a whole song about it - Yeah, Paul Wall - Well, I know the song, but I didn't know it was in the mouth of my head - So yeah,
35:03 I think, I don't know how this originally came about, but I think I was just like, you know what, I want to, like a pendant of my logos This is my business logo, I can't get charging. And I was
35:14 gonna get made in India when my mom was traveling earlier this year. And I'm like a super price conscious person. And so I was like, well, I don't know. I'm gonna have to look at pictures. I
35:21 can't be critiquing in person. I was like, you know, mom, I'll just get it made in Houston. And I was like, who could I do that with? And I just thought, like, you know, Johnny Dang, that
35:31 would be sick to like have this, I think, world renowned, or at least local celebrity jewelry build something that's - I'm so jealous.
35:39 It's so much about it, right? Everything I'm doing now, I'm like, born and raised in Houston, wanna bring as much attention here, be involved with the local community, support small businesses,
35:47 and it's like, I'm gonna do that. And then of course my buddy Matt, who edits videos that we put out, I was like, hey, I want this effect, and he just made it look really badass. And I was
35:55 like, all right, well, this is what we want, right? So yeah, worked with him now - Love that - Love that - Maybe a primary letter for PG, a charging maybe set up for L to - Should we get DW,
36:07 like, chains - Yeah, yeah - I think as soon as we sell the company, we're getting grills, we get everything - Yeah, we're getting grills - Yeah - I was like - No, I do, like, you said your
36:17 price, crunchy, and chiseled, I'm like, how much - Yeah, how much - Under 200 - Wow - Wow - It's just like such a simple piece. And that's what's awesome about it. I went there and I was like,
36:29 are you for real? And he was like, his guy who was helping, he was like, you know, I think their reputation is such that they work with like the best rappers, right - Yes - Everyone's been there
36:38 two chains.
36:39 I don't know about Snoop Dogg, but right? All these rappers and
36:42 celebrities and they do not take advantage of anybody, no matter what you want. It's like, this is their price and their margin, right? It's like amazing. So you get totally fair stuff. Yeah.
36:52 Exactly. Johnny Danger coming for you.
36:56 That's funny. I know, I was like, you know, you dream about things. I'm sure you guys get this as entrepreneurs. Like you dream about things you want to bring into the world is like, man, he's
37:04 currently probably mostly working with like celebrities. I was like, I want to bring into like that business Yeah. Right. More so entrepreneurs. Right. Right. Yeah. Yeah. It'd be cool.
37:13 Houston has a really, a really good, just entrepreneurial community. There's a lot of entrepreneurs here. It's really what a lot of founders, a lot of creators. I don't think it gets the credit
37:24 it deserves. Right. It's just so diverse. Well, and I think it's because we're not as like flashy as like an Austin, we don't want to be. Like I feel like other cities that are, you know,
37:36 self-proclaimed tech hubs and startup hubs are that's what they're pitching. And I don't think Houston has done that. I think we're like, no, we're good. We're kind of just down to earth. We
37:48 have this low key community and ecosystem of startups and entrepreneurs and all that good stuff. But we're like, we'll just keep doing what we're doing. We don't need the flashy. Yeah, we don't
38:02 need to be in the limelight for that. I mean, personally, I don't want Houston to become another Austin So I would prefer it not get that reputation. Yeah, no, I think it's exactly. I think my
38:13 friend had told me, or I had met a customer a while back and he was like, I think, I don't know the term, but anyways, he's saying like all these people in Dallas, they think it's like, again,
38:22 maybe flashy is kind of some of the reputation they get. But he said, when you look at it by call it what people really produce, there's more like millionaires or maybe billionaires here than like,
38:34 you know - Yeah, there are, and I'm pretty sure I read before I moved here that. And I don't know if this is true, but at some point, to that building on that, Houston was the most charitable
38:47 city. Like Houston, let's just say millionaires, business, whatever, give more to charity than locals in any other city in the US - Wow - That gives the, I believe that - They are the most
38:56 charitable
38:59 people - I love that - I live here - Yeah - And you would never think it because we're in, we don't have that reputation as some rich tech hub situation - We wouldn't have real housewives of Houston,
39:09 like they tried to make an Alice - Well, and it's so funny though, because you know that if they try to do that, all like the rich woman in rubber oaks would be like absolutely not - Yeah - Like do
39:18 not be like - No, they would be like, no, no way. No way we're doing that - Yeah - I agree - I love it - All right, are you ready - Not the fire - This is Jules Thing, Jules Sis - Rapid Fire
39:28 Queen - Number one misconception about the EV industry or electrification industry.
39:38 The biggest misconception you said? Probably just that it's not environmentally friendly as touted, right? So I think it's like, oh, it's still pollutes. Well, yeah, something and everything's
39:47 probably gonna pollute, it's about less - Are you gonna start somewhere - Yeah - Yeah - Number two, yeah, why should we care about the electrification industry? I'm gonna mess up that word. I've
39:58 messed it up like four times - The air quality, I think that one's just like simple. It's like one puts out emissions, one doesn't - Yeah - And so, yeah - That analogy, sorry, that analogy of
40:10 the human and the garage is gonna stick with me. Yeah - Should we have kids - Yeah - I always, you know, I've got niece and nephew and it's just like, truly, I mean, yeah. It's like, people
40:23 say, oh, like, someone you don't like, put them in that garage, but it's like, no, you think about the place we're leaving behind and that's what the effect is - Even the refrigerator, one,
40:32 like, could you imagine having to clean out your refrigerator? Put it in the garage - Just change the oil - Just like, Pumping fuel in your kitchen - Yeah, that's like, be ridiculous - Yeah, no
40:42 thank you. Last one, what's your most embarrassing story in your career thus far - All right, I like this. Especially since you added career because, all right, so I was at my last employer
40:54 charge point. I was traveling through Massachusetts and then I was, actually I remember pulling over, so we had, I guess it was like a weekly team call sales meeting for the entire company So
41:04 there must have been maybe 30 plus people on the call. This was obviously pre-COVID, but we still did video calls if you could join in. And so I knew that call was coming up, so while I'm driving
41:15 around, I pulled up too. I think it's Gillette Stadium where the Patriots play. So I was like, Okay, cool, I'm nearby, let me just go see that. So big parking lot empty. I was like, I'll sit
41:24 here, park and take this call off my hotspot. And I don't know if I was new to video conferencing or what, but I remember I was like, All right, I'm gonna turn it on what I need. mute when
41:35 you're not in turn off camera - Right - But man, I got busy digging for something in my nose with that camera on - Oh man -
41:44 And I got a text from my coworker. And so I kinda like,
41:51 it all happened simultaneously because as I'm watching this dig in, I'm like seeing like someone kind of smirking, 'cause right there's a - You're like, oh my god, you're like, what are you
42:00 looking at - Yeah, I was like, and I had no idea And so,
42:05 wow - Yeah, I love that you're telling me - You're really going now - I'm shrinking out of embarrassment. But, so then I get a text and he's like, hey, we can see you picking your nose. And I
42:17 was like, you got this is crazy - Good, you just wanna go melt like that - Yeah, for sure. Especially for my coworkers, 'cause I like. That team of 35, I never see them, they're remote - How
42:24 do you rebound from that too? Like sorry, you just learning - I agree - You just like own it or you should like, you should like happen - I have everybody because their nose - Yeah - I think, yeah.
42:24 I mean, that was like a given and it's like, okay, I'm caught. And I think, so I'm getting text mentioned like, oh crap. And so then I think I pause video, like make sure coast is clear. I'm
42:24 like, all right, what am I doing? And then I think, or maybe my, the
42:28 sales director
42:33 said, hey, noop, 'cause maybe the chats are now catching up He's like
42:54 being distracted. He's like, hey, noop. Apparently you're picking your nose. Like, you know, just so you know, I was like, all right, crap - You're like, I'm aware of things - Yeah, yeah.
43:01 So that was, it's funny until you ask that, I forgot about it, but - That's hilarious - It's cool being like, it's
43:09 also cool because like, yeah, I'm a freaking real human being. Like, normal shit when I'm walking, being normal - I mean, I'm good to call workers for like, letting you know otherwise instead
43:18 of just - 100 weight - You know, letting you pick your nose for hours.
43:23 Those are good coworkers just yesterday, one of my friends texted us and she said that when she got home, she realized there was a huge rip in the back of her pants. She's like, no one told her?
43:31 No, and no one told her. I was like, no one of you are quarantold you that? God, I feel like you would tell each other. I've been so guilty of like people having peppercorns in their teeth
43:39 though, not saying anything. It's tough, it's not good. It's worse, too. 'Cause you think that person's embarrassed because I'm like, no, I'm not embarrassed, like not trying to embarrass you
43:48 or not embarrass you. It's like, we just wanna make sure we're good ones Other people. And if they call it out, then it's like, oh, you're the asshole who didn't tell me. And I can't let
43:58 someone beat you to it. So yeah, yeah. That was a good one. That was, that's probably one of the funniest things. I agree. Leave us a review, subscribe, sponsor, all the things. Help us
44:08 change the world, help us raise the energy. And I think they want to connect with you. Where can they find you? Oh yeah, LinkedIn. LinkedIn is definitely the go-to. Cool. That's where I feel
44:17 like people show some love. But yeah, all your social media finally added a TikTok, which just learning that. But - Do you like your algorithm - I'm so
44:29 like - Are you on funny TikTok - What's that - I said, are you on funny TikTok - Is that like a category or is it like, is it a funny - Well, is your 4U page funny
44:32 or is it weird - It's not yet - It's so stupid - I would love for it to be, 'cause that's
44:36 like, we
44:41 do a YouTube thing which, so I have PNG charging, but this like, total side note, like, the Fast and the Curious, which I don't know if I've shared that - Do you wanna share about that really
44:50 quick before we - Yeah, so, you know, before I got into business for myself, when I was working with my employer, I had side time, I guess, and I was like, all right, works on cruise control,
44:60 I just wanted to create content. And the main spark to that was, I went to sleep one night. My friend was watching a lot of, consuming a lot of online content, 2018, 19, and I was like, oh,
45:12 that's kinda cool, he kept me young. And, so LeBron James was the shop, and all these, the hot sauce ones, hot ones - Yeah, oh, I love it - That's interesting. No name guys who are
45:22 interviewing very high profile people. So I just went to bed one night, this line came to mind, entrepreneurs in EVs. And I was like, boom, as soon as that hits, I got to execute. I was like,
45:34 hey, Matt, my buddy, who edits, I was like, can we shoot like a pilot where we interview an entrepreneur inside of an electric vehicle driving? And so that's where things started - Oh, I love
45:43 that - We named the channel The Fast and the Curious - I like that - And so that is like on all the social media platforms as well, but that one's aimed at EV, like education, but entertainment.
45:53 It's more fun, it's more light-hearted. It's a, let me break you off of like very basic concepts and that's an engaging way - And that's on YouTube - On YouTube, yeah. It's all on all social
45:53 media, but you're gonna find the full length videos on YouTube - Awesome, that sounds fun - Yeah - We should watch one on the TV in the office. Yeah, we watch your EV dude.
46:20 I'm advertising it - Oh, that's super real commercial, I know - I legit thought you - She was like, Wait, this is actually on the Super Bowl? Are you loaded or what -
46:31 Your secret rich aren't amped - I get a sponsor everything - Secret, what do you call it? Savvy Saver or just, yeah, frugal?
46:41 Stocking it away for days like today, you know? Or it's like, yet you find what you wanna do - Wait, fun idea though. We should make every guest film a TikTok with us - Are you filming a TikTok
46:50 with us - I would - Great. I just threw that idea out. Now we actually have to come up with a TikTok idea. Should we end this? Yeah, are you done?
46:60 Are you done - Yeah, no, I mean, nothing else I can think of - Anything else? No, I think - Of all her die - Although I was gonna say coming in, I was like, I wonder - Electrophied -
47:09 Electrophied - Yeah, I like it. Electrophied die - I know, I'm nune-tackling for sure. I
47:15 was like coming in, it was like, it's my first podcast in this cool modern setting. Is this the one where we smoke weed, use curse words, talk about conspiracy - Do we eat spicy nuts - Do we eat
47:24 spicy nuts - I would have to eat so bad - Which one - All of it - All of it - All of it - And which one did you say - The spicy nuts, oh, on one - The death nut - The death nut - I had a sound one -
47:33 They're like super hot peanuts, like deathly hot - I was like the reaction of like people eating different things in the spicy - Yes, but what did we eat - We ate a spicy gummy bear and it hurt so
47:44 bad - I wouldn't do that. I've had friends tell me about it. It just sounds super brutal - Yeah, we're gonna start making this more fun. And engaging - Yeah - Do something - Activities -
47:53 Activities - I would happily be a part to be involved and come back and shout - Oh, I see that. You didn't bring your, you should have brought your game - Which game - The logo game - Oh, dude, I
48:05 have such a bummer - You know - I have a bummer story about that - Did you lose the footage - Oh, I was so looking forward to the zombie - What is it - Can you just re-enact the zombie?
48:17 Like, you were answering to the answer? It was his stating character. He'd say the character. Oh my God. It was so great. I was bummed, 'cause I think, you know, we obviously spoke with Colin
48:25 and just a lot of folks, and there was good responses. I don't know if she told you, but we were like, here's all these logos, basically like Chevron Shell, BP. Okay, cool, you know those
48:34 brands. What about in the EV charging world? Do you know these brands? But yeah, we had a good conversation, unfortunately. I think he filmed over it. That's such a bummer. Yeah I hate when
48:45 that happens. It's happened to us before. Really? Okay, that makes me feel a little bit. Yeah. Yeah, it sucks though. All right, well, goodbye. Thank you, and bye. Bye.
